On Wed, Jun 29, 2005 at 11:09:01AM +0200, Rafal Kupiec
wrote:
> I think, now we're not violating the GPL.
> for eg:
>http://svn.berlios.de/wsvn/hostilix/trunk/Sources/apps/notepad/dialog.c?op=…
You know, it would have been WAY simpler if you had
just not screwed with -any- of the file headers in the
first place. Grab the latest ReactOS SVN, export it,
re-import it into your SVN, then DON'T MESS WITH THE
COPYRIGHT NOTICES. I mean, you've obviously had to do
a lot of work to add your name and replace the
contents of the other files, and look at how much good
it's done you?
In reality, the "right" process is really, really
easy. It's not necessary to plaster your name all
over the place, especially if you haven't done
anything in a given file. Whenever you make a change,
just add your copyright to the start of the file. It's
that easy. It means you do 0 work up front, *and* you
don't have angry devs breathing down your neck about
blatently ripping them off. "Branding" all of the
files, to be frank, is a *very* stupid waste of your
time, and has (clearly) only served to piss everyone
off.
Now, that's not to say people still won't be
disgruntled about it, but they'll grumble much more
quietly -- and it's WAY easier for you to cover your
ass by saying "all of the original copyright notices
in the source are intact" (because if you only add
notices, it doesn't remove or alter the existing
notices). Release everything under GPL, and bam...
you shouldn't run into too much trouble.
Cheers,
-- Travis
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Hi,.
I'm polish fan of ReactOS. I would like to help you in making ReactOS
better.
I have some developer skills with C++ on Windows (x86, CE) platform but i
don't have enough time to help you in this area (maybe i'm to sluggish :-(
).
At this time i would like to help you with translating ReactOS to Polish
language.
In attachement there is a polish translation of userenv.
Sorry for my poor english.
Sebastian Gasiorek
Third post, but, i downloaded their source code, and
it seems the original copyright notices are there, so
they are not violating the GNU licence.
Best regards,
Lucio Diaz.
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http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/gpl-violation.html
Violations of the GPL, LGPL, and GFDL
"how the license was violated:
Is the copyright notice of the copyright holder
included?"
Best regards,
Lucio Diaz.
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Regardless of its legality, removing copyright notes
from the sources, thus refusing the right of the
authors, is RUDE. There would have been no problem, i
am quite sure, if they have just forked reactos and
left copyright notices (adding their names to the
contributing if they add to source in the files). For
example, we did not remove the wine copyright notices.
Still i believe many judges would consider this a
copyright infringment, why? Cause the license says:
"We protect your rights with two steps: (1) copyright
the software, and (2) offer you this license which
gives you legal permission to copy, distribute and/or
modify the software."
The licence gives you permision to modify the software
(thus the source code), but says nothing about
granting the right to modify the copyright notices.
This is something to be said by an advocate of course.
My best sugestion would be to contact the FSF, explain
the situation, and ask them what to do.
Best regards,
Lucio Diaz.
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On Mon, Jun 27, 2005 at 10:43:26PM +0200,
KJKHyperion wrote:
> Quandary wrote:
>
> > And that's my point exactly -- you'd need a lawyer
> > to interpret that, and ultimately it's the judge
> > who makes the final decision
>
> nope. In these matters, the copyright holder
> basically owns your ass. We can revoke all rights to
> anyone we please.
That depends on the jurisdiction, which is another
big whole mess. No one person owns the copyright,
here, and there are contributors in lots of
countries. So... which court would this even
be tried in? Whose laws apply?
We don't have a revokation clause in the license;
does this mean it's revokable? Non-revokable? Again,
you need a lawyer and *some* semblance of
jurisdiction before you can even begin to start
untangling this mess.
> Copyleft is just good manners, copyright is the
> law. Remember this already happened: a fork of
> OpenBSD was killed by license termination in
> response to copyright misrepresentation - and, boy,
> does it take a special brand of stupidity to manage
> to violate a BSD license
1) links, please.
2) Copyleft is law, too -- since it's based directly
on copyright. Some licenses leverage that legal
ability (GPL), some don't (BSD).
> That said, the Hostilix people have no shame and no
> fear; they are well-known copyright violators (their
> WinuxOS was a repackaged Windows 2000, wasting
> SourceForge's bandwidth too) and are doing their
> best to alienate us; they are a bunch of loser punk
> posers who embarass the whole OS-development scene.
> Let them get away with it, they are do-no-good hacks
> and nothing can punish them worse than simply
> existing. Hostilix will die naturally from the
> complete lack of any form of skill on the part of
> the pathetic clowns who conceived it
Agreed.
-- Travis
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Hello,
I was wondering if someone was interested in writing an open source version
of Mac OS X. I know about Darwin already so please don't comment about it.
I was thinking that Darwin could be a base for this project. I figure it
could start out like a 10.0 version with minimal application support to
allow Mac OS X binaries to run. Maybe on either PPC or x86 but even better
x86_64.
Tell me what you think.
On Mon, Jun 27, 2005 at 04:32:25PM -0500, Rick
Langschultz wrote:
> I understand the terms and conditions of all of the
> licenses about open source software, but this is out
> of left field. Please be a little more specific in
> the details why you have composed this email. Many
> of us don't use IRC, at least I don't. So please
> explain what is going on. That is just courtesy.
>
<snip>
Search the list for "HostiliX". The whole thing
started on the list with an unsolicited E-mail
from another project informing us that they were
essentially forking ReactOS. Much discussion about
the topic has followed those initial E-mails.
-- Travis
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On Mon, Jun 27, 2005 at 10:19:38PM +0200, Oliver
Schneider wrote:
>
> > Not true. The whole point of the BSD is that a
> > business can take your code, make a product, and
> > release that product with whatever (sub)license
> > they want. This happens all of the time, and is
> > the major "boon" of the BSD.
> Actually I cannot find this anywhere in the license.
> But I'll believe you ;)
Google for:
"incorporate BSD code" proprietary OR "closed source"
And skim.
> > This also means that BSD code could
> > (theoretically) become extinct in the "free" word;
> > e.g., if all versions of the code could be snapped
> > up by proprietary vendors, and all public mirrors
> > disappeared. This is one of the reasons people
> > choose GPL over BSD -- they want to ensure that
> > the source stays open and (additionally) that
> > changes get fed back to the community if the
> > binaries are distributed.
> That's exactly why I carefully choose my license
> beforehand. Some of my codes are GPL (currently 2
> projects). These are things where the efforts
> should not be used "commercially" (usually the GPL
> keeps away companies in the Wintel-world) by others.
Then you must understand -- when companies USE it
commercially, they are sublicensing your code under
their own EULA. They fulfill their obligation to you
(i.e., put in the notices), and then have free reign
to relicense the code as they see fit, so long as
they continue to fulfill your requirements.
> > Here is the text of the BSD license:
> I know it. But which part tells me someone can
> sublicense it?
Which part of the following statements says I can
plug in a toaster?
* You may use this electrical socket if you conform to
all of the following rules.
* You agree not to draw more than 20A of current.
* You agree to use proper external grounding on all
equipment that is plugged in.
The BSD license is exactly the same; very open-ended.
I could turn around and make a night-light with a
pass-trough plug in that stated:
* You may use this electrical socket if you conform to
all of the following rules.
* You agree not draw more than 2A
* You agree never to turn the light on
* You agree to turn over your first-born child to
Evil NiteLite inc.
And it wouldn't be breaing the rules of the first
statement at all.
> You know the problem here is the following:
> - No, I have no problem with projects using GPL to
> use my BSDLed code
> - Yes, I have a problem if my BSDLed code is
> published by them under the terms of the GPL.
> Because this means they can restrict the rights I
> have granted to the licensees. I think this is not
> possible like this!
Well, that's how BSD works everywhere. That's how
companys can sub-license it into their own code, and
that's how the GPL works with it, too.
An excerpt
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_and_GPL_licensing>
Traditionally, Linux associated software is licensed
under the GPL, whilst BSD derivatives often use the
BSD license. Code licensed under the BSD license can
be relicensed under the GPL (the BSD license is said
to be "GPL-compatible") without securing the consent
of all original authors; but code under the GPL cannot
be relicensed under the BSD license without securing
the consent of all original authors, as the BSD
license does not necessarily require the source code
to be again freely available.
> If I understand the cited paragraphs of the GPL
> correctly it means that the code parts can be used
> but do not become GPLed. That's my view from reading
> it.
See GPL section 2.b:
You must cause any work that you distribute or
publish, that in whole or in part contains or is
derived from the Program or any part thereof,
*to be licensed as a whole
(at no charge to all third parties)
under the terms of this License.*
(emphasis mine)
The whole thing. Including your BSD code. ALL of it
has to be licensed as GPL to be distributed.
> > So yes, your BSD source code can be sub-licensed
> > by pretty much everybody, and it can also be
> > "converted" to GPL (i.e. it's "GPL-compatible').
> "GPL-compatible" is okay with me (that's OpenSource
> ;) ... "GPLed" - i.e. restricted by GPL - is not.
>
> > I'll take the opportunity to kill two birds with
> > one stone on this one.
> (-: We Germans kill two flies instead of birds :-P
Actually, that's a good idea ;)
> > Defaulting to saying it's inappropriate means that
> > we could implicitly terminate any of these
> > licenses even on suspicion (i.e., guilty until
> > proven innocent), and that just doesn't make
> > sense.
> That's an interesting view.
>
> > Von: Royce Mitchell III
> > Sounds to me the most prudent course of action
> > would be a new version of the GPL license which
> > clarifies this particular bit of confusion.
> This is being worked on currently (AFAIK). They want
> to make it much simpler so non-native speakers can
> understand it without a PhD from a law school ;)
Which will be really hard, since the GPL is one of
the clearest mid-sized licenses I've ever read.
It crams a lot of complexity into very easy-to-
understand, clear, specific terms. The "appropriate"
ambiguity is a very unfortunate oversight :/.
-- Travis
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