I heard that ReactOS is nearly 80 or not yet 80 percent complete. I feel that if we are seriously going to for true compatibility with Microsoft Windows it may be a necessary evil to contact Microsoft about this MS-LPL license--and other things.
It may be that don't really care either way. It may be they do. But its better to know then not to know in this case I feel. I know the feelings about proprietary code and avoid trade secrets. But what if a good relationship with Microsoft makes or breaks ReactOS?
I mean the worst thing that Microsoft will do is say no, or give bogus terms of use. But your expecting that.
What if they start to contribute to ReactOS because they see you have a good product, and you are reputable people. -------Original Message-------
From: ros-dev-request@reactos.org Date: 11/29/13 14:32:25 To: ros-dev@reactos.org Subject: Ros-dev Digest, Vol 111, Issue 24
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. (Alexander Andrejevic) 2. Re: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. (Pierre Schweitzer) 3. Re: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. (Herm?s B?LUSCA - MA?TO) 4. Re: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. (Aleksey Bragin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 17:05:12 +0000 From: Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org To: ReactOS Development List ros-dev@reactos.org Subject: Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. Message-ID: 20131129170512.GB11454@SDF.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I suppose it depends on how you interpret it. To me, "...extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product" sounds like the program must run on Windows exclusively. It's not "... that you create to run ...", but "... that you create that run ...".
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:55:08PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz) wrote:
I do not agree on the "unless it's on Microsoft Windows" part. The license grants apply if it is "created to run directly" on windows, which I understand as "it can run anywhere else, also, just as long as it runs in windows without an intermediary".
On 29 November 2013 17:51, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Fastfat is located inside its own binary, so this is considered "mere
aggregation", and
that is not the problem. (See https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq
html#MereAggregation).
The problem is that you don't even have a license to use it or
distribute it, unless it's
on Microsoft Windows. Then again, I'm not a lawyer either and I could be wrong too. It would
be great if someone
who knows a lot about licenses explained this.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:35:21PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz)
wrote:
The exact words of the license, as seen at http://www.ohloh.net/licenses/mslpl (I couldn't find a better link for it), are:
"4. (F) Platform Limitation- The licenses granted in sections 2(A) & 2(B) extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product."
Excluding that term, the rest of the license is mostly a differently-worded BSD license. If it only needs to be tested in windows to ensure that it works there, then there should be absolutely no problem including it in ReactOS, as long as the terms don't conflict with the other licenses' terms. And GPL with the ReactOS exception, as far as I can tell, allows it. I'm not a lawyer, though, so I could be wrong.
On 29 November 2013 16:17, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Hi Ged,
Are you sure that we can use software released under the MS-LPL? It
has a rather weird
limitation in section 4, which says that you can only use it on a
Microsoft Windows operating system product".
Since ReactOS is not Windows, that would mean we can't use it. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 02:58:51PM -0000, Ged Murphy wrote:
Hi Eric,
I know this has been discussed before, but should we not just bite
the bullet and replace this driver with the Microsoft driver.
The MS_LPL license allows it to be used in reactos, and it would
certainly get rid of any unknowns and give us a reliable filesystem to work from.
com/windowshardware/fastfat-File-System-Driver-135bdf34/view/SourceCode
Ged.
-----Original Message----- From: ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org
[mailto:ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org] On Behalf Of ekohl@svn.reactos.org
Sent: 29 November 2013 14:06 To: ros-diffs@reactos.org Subject: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT]
FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
Author: ekohl Date: Fri Nov 29 14:05:43 2013 New Revision: 61145
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
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-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
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-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
------------------------------
Message: 2 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 18:24:23 +0100 From: Pierre Schweitzer pierre@reactos.org To: ros-dev@reactos.org Subject: Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. Message-ID: 5298CDC7.7030300@reactos.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi all,
Let's the experts do.
I've contacted the April (French association which mission is to promote and defend FOSS). They can answer about licensing issues (they propose it through their contact form).
I'll keep you informed with their answers, highlights, and so on.
Regards,
On 11/29/2013 06:05 PM, Alexander Andrejevic wrote:
I suppose it depends on how you interpret it. To me, "...extend only to the software or derivative works that you create
that run
on a Microsoft Windows operating system product" sounds like the program
must run
on Windows exclusively. It's not "... that you create to run ...", but "..
that you
create that run ...".
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:55:08PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz) wrote:
I do not agree on the "unless it's on Microsoft Windows" part. The license grants apply if it is "created to run directly" on windows, which I understand as "it can run anywhere else, also, just as long as it runs in windows without an intermediary".
On 29 November 2013 17:51, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Fastfat is located inside its own binary, so this is considered "mere
aggregation", and
that is not the problem. (See https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq
html#MereAggregation).
The problem is that you don't even have a license to use it or
distribute it, unless it's
on Microsoft Windows. Then again, I'm not a lawyer either and I could be wrong too. It would
be great if someone
who knows a lot about licenses explained this.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:35:21PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz)
wrote:
The exact words of the license, as seen at http://www.ohloh.net/licenses/mslpl (I couldn't find a better link for it), are:
"4. (F) Platform Limitation- The licenses granted in sections 2(A) & 2(B) extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product."
Excluding that term, the rest of the license is mostly a differently-worded BSD license. If it only needs to be tested in windows to ensure that it works there, then there should be absolutely no problem including it in ReactOS, as long as the terms don't conflict with the other licenses' terms. And GPL with the ReactOS exception, as far as I can tell, allows it. I'm not a lawyer, though, so I could be wrong.
On 29 November 2013 16:17, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Hi Ged,
Are you sure that we can use software released under the MS-LPL? It
has a rather weird
limitation in section 4, which says that you can only use it on a
Microsoft Windows operating system product".
Since ReactOS is not Windows, that would mean we can't use it. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 02:58:51PM -0000, Ged Murphy wrote:
Hi Eric,
I know this has been discussed before, but should we not just bite
the bullet and replace this driver with the Microsoft driver.
The MS_LPL license allows it to be used in reactos, and it would
certainly get rid of any unknowns and give us a reliable filesystem to work from.
com/windowshardware/fastfat-File-System-Driver-135bdf34/view/SourceCode
Ged.
-----Original Message----- From: ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org [mailto:ros-diffs-bounces@reactos
org] On Behalf Of ekohl@svn.reactos.org
Sent: 29 November 2013 14:06 To: ros-diffs@reactos.org Subject: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT]
FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
Author: ekohl Date: Fri Nov 29 14:05:43 2013 New Revision: 61145
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
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-- Pierre Schweitzer pierre@reactos.org System Administrator ReactOS Foundation
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Message: 3 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 18:55:04 +0100 From: Herm?s B?LUSCA - MA?TO hermes.belusca@sfr.fr To: 'ReactOS Development List' ros-dev@reactos.org Subject: Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. Message-ID: 00db01ceed2c$223cffd0$66b6ff70$@sfr.fr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Nice idea Pierre!
About this license we're talking about: yes I understand as Aleksander: that you can only use fastfat or derived works from it, on an (authentic) Windows OS (just my 2 cents, I'm not a lawyer too).
Herm?s.
-----Message d'origine----- De?: ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] De la part de Pierre Schweitzer Envoy??: vendredi 29 novembre 2013 18:24 ??: ros-dev@reactos.org Objet?: Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
Hi all,
Let's the experts do.
I've contacted the April (French association which mission is to promote and defend FOSS). They can answer about licensing issues (they propose it through their contact form).
I'll keep you informed with their answers, highlights, and so on.
Regards,
On 11/29/2013 06:05 PM, Alexander Andrejevic wrote:
I suppose it depends on how you interpret it. To me, "...extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product" sounds like the program must run on Windows exclusively. It's not "... that you create to run ...", but "... that you create that run ...".
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:55:08PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz) wrote:
I do not agree on the "unless it's on Microsoft Windows" part. The license grants apply if it is "created to run directly" on windows, which I understand as "it can run anywhere else, also, just as long as it runs in windows without an intermediary".
On 29 November 2013 17:51, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Fastfat is located inside its own binary, so this is considered "mere aggregation", and that is not the problem. (See
https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#MereAggregation).
The problem is that you don't even have a license to use it or distribute it, unless it's on Microsoft Windows. Then again, I'm not a lawyer either and I could be wrong too. It would be great if someone who knows a lot about licenses explained this.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:35:21PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz)
wrote:
The exact words of the license, as seen at http://www.ohloh.net/licenses/mslpl (I couldn't find a better link for it), are:
"4. (F) Platform Limitation- The licenses granted in sections 2(A) & 2(B) extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product."
Excluding that term, the rest of the license is mostly a differently-worded BSD license. If it only needs to be tested in windows to ensure that it works there, then there should be absolutely no problem including it in ReactOS, as long as the terms don't conflict with the other licenses' terms. And GPL with the ReactOS exception, as far as I can tell, allows it. I'm not a lawyer, though, so I could be wrong.
On 29 November 2013 16:17, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Hi Ged,
Are you sure that we can use software released under the MS-LPL? It has a rather weird limitation in section 4, which says that you can
only use it on a "Microsoft Windows operating system product".
Since ReactOS is not Windows, that would mean we can't use it. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 02:58:51PM -0000, Ged Murphy wrote:
Hi Eric,
I know this has been discussed before, but should we not just bite
the bullet and replace this driver with the Microsoft driver.
The MS_LPL license allows it to be used in reactos, and it would
certainly get rid of any unknowns and give us a reliable filesystem to work from.
http://code.msdn.microsoft.com/windowshardware/fastfat-File-Syste m-Driver-135bdf34/view/SourceCode
Ged.
-----Original Message----- From: ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org [mailto:ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org] On Behalf Of ekohl@svn.reactos.org Sent: 29 November 2013 14:06 To: ros-diffs@reactos.org Subject: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT]
FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
Author: ekohl Date: Fri Nov 29 14:05:43 2013 New Revision: 61145
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev@reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- Pierre Schweitzer pierre@reactos.org System Administrator ReactOS Foundation
------------------------------
Message: 4 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 23:31:03 +0400 From: Aleksey Bragin aleksey@reactos.org To: ReactOS Development List ros-dev@reactos.org Subject: Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time. Message-ID: 5298EB77.7040509@reactos.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
To give you my position: 1. Current FAT driver in ReactOS needs to die away. I am testing all my new code with the MS's FASTFAT driver. 2. Lawyers advice is needed whether we can distribute it.
Regards, Aleksey Bragin
On 29.11.2013 21:55, Herm?s B?LUSCA - MA?TO wrote:
Nice idea Pierre!
About this license we're talking about: yes I understand as Aleksander:
that
you can only use fastfat or derived works from it, on an (authentic)
Windows
OS (just my 2 cents, I'm not a lawyer too).
Herm?s.
-----Message d'origine----- De : ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] De
la
part de Pierre Schweitzer Envoy? : vendredi 29 novembre 2013 18:24 ? : ros-dev@reactos.org Objet : Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT] FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
Hi all,
Let's the experts do.
I've contacted the April (French association which mission is to promote
and
defend FOSS). They can answer about licensing issues (they propose it through their contact form).
I'll keep you informed with their answers, highlights, and so on.
Regards,
On 11/29/2013 06:05 PM, Alexander Andrejevic wrote:
I suppose it depends on how you interpret it. To me, "...extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product" sounds like the program must run on Windows exclusively. It's not "... that you create to run ...", but "... that you create that run ...".
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:55:08PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz)
wrote:
I do not agree on the "unless it's on Microsoft Windows" part. The license grants apply if it is "created to run directly" on windows, which I understand as "it can run anywhere else, also, just as long as it runs in windows without an intermediary".
On 29 November 2013 17:51, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Fastfat is located inside its own binary, so this is considered "mere aggregation", and that is not the problem. (See
https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#MereAggregation).
The problem is that you don't even have a license to use it or distribute it, unless it's on Microsoft Windows. Then again, I'm not a lawyer either and I could be wrong too. It would be great if someone who knows a lot about licenses explained this
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 05:35:21PM +0100, David Quintana (gigaherz)
wrote:
The exact words of the license, as seen at http://www.ohloh.net/licenses/mslpl (I couldn't find a better link for it), are:
"4. (F) Platform Limitation- The licenses granted in sections 2(A) & 2(B) extend only to the software or derivative works that you create that run on a Microsoft Windows operating system product."
Excluding that term, the rest of the license is mostly a differently-worded BSD license. If it only needs to be tested in windows to ensure that it works there, then there should be absolutely no problem including it in ReactOS, as long as the terms don't conflict with the other licenses' terms. And GPL with the ReactOS exception, as far as I can tell, allows it. I'm not a lawyer, though, so I could be wrong.
On 29 November 2013 16:17, Alexander Andrejevic theflash@sdf.lonestar.org wrote:
Hi Ged,
Are you sure that we can use software released under the MS-LPL? It has a rather weird limitation in section 4, which says that you
can
only use it on a "Microsoft Windows operating system product".
Since ReactOS is not Windows, that would mean we can't use it. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards, Alexander
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 02:58:51PM -0000, Ged Murphy wrote: > Hi Eric, > > I know this has been discussed before, but should we not just bite
the bullet and replace this driver with the Microsoft driver.
> The MS_LPL license allows it to be used in reactos, and it would
certainly get rid of any unknowns and give us a reliable filesystem to
work
from.
> http://code.msdn.microsoft.com/windowshardware/fastfat-File-Syste > m-Driver-135bdf34/view/SourceCode > > Ged. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org > [mailto:ros-diffs-bounces@reactos.org] On Behalf Of > ekohl@svn.reactos.org > Sent: 29 November 2013 14:06 > To: ros-diffs@reactos.org > Subject: [ros-diffs] [ekohl] 61145: [FASTFAT]
FsdGetFsVolumeInformation: Return volume creation time.
> Author: ekohl > Date: Fri Nov 29 14:05:43 2013 > New Revision: 61145 > > >
------------------------------
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