17 May
2016
17 May
'16
6:04 p.m.
The project doesn't have to be hard-coded to NT5. For example, I am
building a UEFI loader/bootmgr based on Windows 10, because 2003
doesn't boot on UEFI systems.
That being said, I don't see any good reason for us not to still
mainly focus on 2003 for the kernel. The kernel is NOT what's
preventing apps from working, or hardware from working. What's
preventing that from working is:
1) Lacking user-mode APIs, and in some cases Rtl APIs (sure, implement
Win 10 ones!)
2) Lacking hardware support for things like UEFI (I'm working on it),
AHCI (we have a student working on it), USB 3 (someone can implement
this...but USB 2 barely works), etc..etc..etc..
Find me a single device driver that *only* works on NT 6... Server
2003 is still a support MS OS, so by definition there's still drivers
for it.
Best regards,
Alex Ionescu
On Tue, May 17, 2016 at 4:44 PM, Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
<elhoir(a)gmail.com> wrote:
"companies and such support NT5?"
where "support NT5", i meant "drop support for NT5", sorry
On Tue, May 17, 2016 at 4:43 PM, Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
<elhoir(a)gmail.com> wrote:
And why does few developers, companies and such support NT5? Because MS
dropped support for those systems. But if ReactOS revives that support,
maybe companies will support us.
On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 10:22 PM, Riccardo Paolo Bestetti
<riccardo.kyogre(a)live.it> wrote:
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I'd like to drop my two cents, just because I really believe in this
project's filosofy. Since things have gotten pretty hot in the past,
especially when someone who is not a developer intervened in a discussion,
let me apprise you that my only intention it to bring in the point of view
of a potential user that really wants to see ReactOS happen and isn't
emotionally attached to the work that has been done.
The reality is that very very few manufacturers and developers still
support NT5 and all of them are going to drop support in the next few years.
This is just a fact. NT5 is legacy software and there's nothing no one can
do about that.
I've followed this project and this mailing list for the past five years
and in this time I've upgraded all of the computer systems of my father's
business to Windows 7 and then to Windows 10, because all the pieces of
software they run dropped support for NT5, one after another. They still
have a single machine in the whole building running Windows XP, for legacy
software, and honestly they don't use it very often. In my school, pretty
much the same. And even if someone, for whatever reason, intends to run NT5
for 10 more years, why should (s)he re-setup all the systems again to run
ReactOS instead of keeping Windows XP?
The point is, you can either implement the architecture that runs all of
the computer in building, or the architecture that runs that one legacy
machine. And even that would happen if and only if you can achieve 100%
compatibility with all of NT5 and Windows XP bugs and quirks and give people
a really good reason to reinstall the OS on such machines, and sorry that's
just not gonna happen.
I get why some of you may want to stick to NT5, but you have to be aware
that if you do that ReactOS will never be used in the real world. No reason
to stick to NT5 is good enough, since no one out there needs or wants NT5.
Hell, it would probably be easier for a business to switch from NT6 to
GNU/Linux than to go back to NT5.
Again, these are just the two cents of a guy that works in the field.
Best regards,
--- Riccardo Paolo Bestetti
Il 16/05/2016 16:42, Ged Murphy ha scritto:
But you’re missing the point. The problem is that modern software is
leaving XP behind and focusing on Win7 as a minimum recommended requirement.
What use is ReactOS if none of the modern browsers or applications will
run on it? It limits the OS to being a compatibility solution for older
software, or a POS device. No one really wants to see that.
I think the best solution to start with is to keep reporting as 5.2 in
the kernel, but allowing developers to start moving to the NT6 model. An
mish-mash of NT5 and NT6 can co-exist as long things are done sensibly. e.g.
adding IO cancelation to our NT5 kernel isn’t going to make us incompatible
for XP’s drivers, but it allows us to implement an NT6 feature which hugely
benefits the OS. Other obvious candidates are unimplemented areas such as
the fltmgr . Why implement the 2k3 fltmgr when we can implement a later
fltmgr model which still loads older filter drivers.
Usermode should also still report as win2k3 (at least in the short term),
but start to add NT6 APIs directly into the codebase instead of using a
shim. We then maintain a whitelist of processes that don’t run on ros due to
a minimum requirement issue, and they get a modified result from
VerifyVersionInfo (and friends) to a later OS version.
The above changes keep things pretty simple to start with, and allow us
to move forward almost immediately with very little infrastructure work.
Ged.
From: Ros-dev [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] On Behalf Of Javier
Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
Sent: 15 May 2016 22:55
To: ReactOS Development List <ros-dev(a)reactos.org>
Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Pale Moon drops ReactOS support
"Being runnable only on old computers"
I think this is a bad understanding of the problem....
By such statement, it seems that ReactOS will only work on old computers.
And thats not true.
ReactOS may work in any computer where there is hardware drivers for.
And, as such, any software written for XP/2k3/ReactOS will work in that
computer.
And afaik, manufacturers are still releasing drivers compatible with XP
:) (nVidia, for example....)
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