Many got it pre-installed with their machines. Sure Windows 7 may run on pre-2007 machines if you bought it for over six thousand bucks, but that still doesn't resolve another issue (which i forgot to mention) - compatibility.
Gotta love that philosophy "who cares about 2.5GB or 8GB" - the operating system starts doing it, and then all the programs follow. Remember MSN Messenger 1.0? That was only a few hundred kilobytes to few megabytes to install. Now its over 180MB to install.
Which application do you want to bloat today?
<ps... i think the thread has been derailed>
On Sun, 05 Jun 2011 05:34:20 +1000, Alex Ionescu ionucu@videotron.ca wrote:
Windows 7 runs on pre-2007 computers just fine, so that's irrelevant.
Windows 7 is available as a trial, and also for free for students, and also for only 99$ as an upgrade to XP, which came out a decade ago. So there's people who don't have 99$/10 years? How did they get XP then?
Windows 7 does not take up 15GB of disk space. A fresh install of Ultimate uses 8.64GB.
If 8.64GB is too much, you can use Windows 7 for Thin PCs, which is in CTP right now. It uses ~2.7GB of space for a fresh install, only slightly higher than XP's 1.5.
(Also, who the cares about 2.5 or 8GB when you can get a 1TB disk for 100$ these days?)
-- Best regards, Alex Ionescu
On 2011-06-04, at 3:03 PM, Adam wrote:
I am aware of that. I was talking about Microsoft Windows and not ReactOS - and was responding to someone who suggested "Update to Windows Vista+, which has KTM."
Please read the messages that are being replied to as well, other than just the replies.
On Sun, 05 Jun 2011 04:53:43 +1000, Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo elhoir@gmail.com wrote:
Adam... ReactOS will not be Win Vista/7 ;)
On Sat, Jun 4, 2011 at 8:05 PM, Adam geekdundee@gmail.com wrote:
And what about people with computers older than 2007 and/or people who do not want to (and/or cannot) pay $$$ for an upgrade and/or people who do not want to install an operating system that takes up 15GB of disk space?
On Sun, 05 Jun 2011 03:59:46 +1000, Alex Ionescu ionucu@videotron.ca wrote:
Update to Windows Vista+, which has KTM.
-- Best regards, Alex Ionescu
On 2011-06-04, at 10:21 AM, Adam wrote:
A number of times (eg. .NET install/AV install) I have had it happen at
the end of the install. Then when I attempt to uninstall it there are errors produced regarding it (often not just after a fresh install of Windows; I mean after using the computer for some time - particularly after updating Windows Installer) then it makes the product difficult (if not impossible) to uninstall.
On Sun, 05 Jun 2011 00:07:44 +1000, Zachary Gorden < drakekaizer666@gmail.com> wrote:
And how many times does the database get corrupted? I've never run into > it > and the conditions that would cause a corruption would equally > screw any > other installer, since it would have to be a run that got > interrupted > mid-install. > > On Sat, Jun 4, 2011 at 8:58 AM, Adam geekdundee@gmail.com wrote: > > Next will you be suggesting for people to use MMC snapins as > opposed to >> writing standalone applications, because it is shitty standalone >> applications that do things and not MMC? >> >> You can use WIX/MSI to write shitty installers too if I am not >> mistaken. >> I've seen brilliant NSIS/InstallShield installers and shitty MSI >> installers. >> And vice versa. >> >> As an end-user I must say MSI also tends to piss me off, >> particularly >> when >> the database gets corrupted and what not. Good concept though, >> but I >> question the way it is implemented. I have written about what I >> think >> about >> MSI in another mail so no need for me to repeat myself. >> >> But what I am trying to suggest is that shitty installers will be >> shitty >> installers. You can write shitty installers in >> >> SuperDuperUltraInstallerLanguageSoGoodItIsGuaranteedToMakeOtherInstallersShitTheirPantsAndGoBankrupt >> and they will still be shitty installers. >> >> >> On Sat, 04 Jun 2011 23:49:26 +1000, Alex Ionescu >> ionucu@videotron.ca >> wrote: >> >> Oh, I do believe shitty software/installers do this. >> >>> >>> Microsoft's technologies do not, however. >>> >>> So use WIX/MSI, not NSI/InstallShield. >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Alex Ionescu >>> >>> On 2011-06-04, at 9:23 AM, Kamil Hornicek wrote: >>> >>> I'm in charge of 40+ PCs running mostly XP at work. Believe me >>> when I >>> >>>> tell you people do write their own code (or use the available >>>> API >>>> incorrectly) for installers or some online activation bullshit. >>>> I >>>> came >>>> across several installers/apps that were unable to detect or >>>> use our >>>> proxy >>>> (we also use wpad for proxy autodiscovery via dns) and I always >>>> had >>>> to >>>> connect that PC directly to our gateway to make stuff install >>>> which >>>> is >>>> annoying as hell. I am not making this up, pay me a visit if you >>>> think >>>> otherwise. >>>> >>>> K. >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alex Ionescu" < >>>> ionucu@videotron.ca> >>>> To: "ReactOS Development List" ros-dev@reactos.org >>>> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 8:20 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] 1294 [dreimer] Fix clean for cmake >>>> trees. ... >>>> >>>> >>>> Again all of this is irrelevant: since I think you are a Linux >>>> user, >>>> I >>>> >>>>> can understand why you are confused. >>>>> >>>>> On Windows, all HTTP communication is done by WinHTTP and/or >>>>> WinINET, >>>>> nobody writes their own custom socket code. >>>>> >>>>> WinHTTP/WinINET control the proxy settings for the machine. In >>>>> fact, >>>>> if >>>>> you use Google Chrome on Windows (or Safari) and go to the >>>>> proxy/connection >>>>> settings, you will see "IE's" proxy connection dialog -- >>>>> because >>>>> these >>>>> settings/dialog are owned by the OS Library, not the individual >>>>> applications. >>>>> >>>>> Therefore, the installer will use 100% the same settings as >>>>> the web >>>>> browser, including the same protocol. >>>>> >>>>> So, as I stated, if the browser can download foo.exe, so will >>>>> the >>>>> online >>>>> installer. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> Alex Ionescu >>>>> >>>>> On 2011-06-03, at 1:50 PM, Kamil Hornicek wrote: >>>>> >>>>> whatever you use for downloading the installer has to be >>>>> configured >>>>> to >>>>> >>>>>> connect throught the proxy and also to use its dns services >>>>>> for >>>>>> host name >>>>>> resolving. if the installer itself isn't aware of the need for >>>>>> proxy server >>>>>> (or is not able to connect through socks or whatever the proxy >>>>>> uses) it >>>>>> won't be usually able to resolve the hostname it's trying to >>>>>> connect to >>>>>> (depends on the exact network configuration). also the default >>>>>> route to the >>>>>> internet would be missing or direct outgoing connections >>>>>> would be >>>>>> blocked >>>>>> (which they usually are otherwise you wouldn't be forced to >>>>>> use the >>>>>> proxy >>>>>> server in the first place) so the traffic generated by the >>>>>> installer >>>>>> wouldn't have any means to reach its destination. >>>>>> >>>>>> I didn't want to derail the discussion and I apologize for >>>>>> that. >>>>>> I'll >>>>>> shut up next time. >>>>>> >>>>>> Kamil >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alex Ionescu" < >>>>>> ionucu@videotron.ca >>>>>> > >>>>>> To: "ReactOS Development List" ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 7:03 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] 1294 [dreimer] Fix clean for cmake >>>>>> trees. >>>>>> ... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Since online installers use HTTP, and the user got the >>>>>> installer >>>>>> off >>>>>> >>>>>>> HTTP, what would a proxy server change? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>> Alex Ionescu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 2011-06-03, at 12:33 PM, Kamil Hornicek wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I didn't want to spam this discussion but I have to.. What >>>>>>> every >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> other software company also does is refusing to believe >>>>>>>> someone >>>>>>>> might be >>>>>>>> behind a proxy server. If you go this way, please make sure >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> installer >>>>>>>> doesn't need a direct connection. Also online installers are >>>>>>>> generally a >>>>>>>> major pain in the ass if you don't provide an offline >>>>>>>> installer >>>>>>>> too. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: Alex Ionescu >>>>>>>> To: ReactOS Development List >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 5:56 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] 1294 [dreimer] Fix clean for cmake >>>>>>>> trees. >>>>>>>> ... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Why separate installers for x64/ARM? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just do what every software company this side of the century >>>>>>>> does: a >>>>>>>> 400kb installer which lets you select the packages you >>>>>>>> want, and >>>>>>>> downloads >>>>>>>> them. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>>> Alex Ionescu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 2011-06-03, at 11:38 AM, Zachary Gorden wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Spoke with Amine and Daniel. I've agreed to the lesser >>>>>>>> evil of >>>>>>>> bundling the FULL cmake. Reasons are if we want the BE to >>>>>>>> be >>>>>>>> flexible >>>>>>>> enough to be used for more than just building ROS, we can't >>>>>>>> gimp >>>>>>>> cmake with >>>>>>>> the belief that no one will need the things we didn't >>>>>>>> include. >>>>>>>> This is again >>>>>>>> on Windows. I remain uninvolved with decisions about the >>>>>>>> Linux >>>>>>>> BE. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2011 at 10:34 AM, Colin Finck >>>>>>>> colin@reactos.org >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Timo Kreuzer timo.kreuzer@web.de wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My vote on this: >>>>>>>> CMake: bundle it, optional on installation >>>>>>>> x64/arm: create individual installers >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * CMake: bundle it, go for the (minimal) version without an >>>>>>>> installer. It's nothing "exotic" to install after all, just >>>>>>>> put >>>>>>>> it together >>>>>>>> with the other utilities in RosBE. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * x64/arm: If build tool sizes are staying like this, create >>>>>>>> individual installers. Just for testing, I'll try an x86/x64 >>>>>>>> multilib build >>>>>>>> of Binutils and GCC though, would be nice to know how much >>>>>>>> smaller it is >>>>>>>> compared to separate x86 and x64 compilers. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So in general, I agree with Timo :-) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - Colin >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ros-dev mailing list >>>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ros-dev mailing list >>> Ros-dev@reactos.org >>> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Using Opera's revolutionary email client: >> http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ros-dev mailing list >> Ros-dev@reactos.org >> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev >> >>
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