17 Oct
2006
17 Oct
'06
3:30 p.m.
On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 09:27:22 -0400
Alex Ionescu <ionucu(a)videotron.ca> wrote:
art yerkes wrote:
Creating a position nobody can fill didn't work. No cookies.
On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 16:53:09 -0400
Alex Ionescu <ionucu(a)videotron.ca> wrote:
I'm not putting it all on Wax. I didn't even mention Wax's name. I
simply said that we should get a TC that is able to do the job we ALL
VOTED ON.
It's sad that this project has become one where being honest and
truthful is now "despicable".
Anyways, I'm officially announcing that I decide not to respect the IP
Policy that we voted on anymore. Anyone that complains will be called
"despicable". Because hey, I'll be "trying my best".
Seriously, this isn't kindergarden. This is a serious OS Project with
rules and consitution that we voted and agreed upon. When I drafted the
TC document it was to make sure that such breakages would not happen
again. It doesn't mean it's the TC's fault, it just means he didn't do
the right job. You can have the best development team in the world, if
they won't have a QA/Software Testing team you'll get code that's buggy
and doesn't work on everyone's computer.
I'm going to lose a friend over this, but
whatever.
I only have one comment:
Get a TC that has the time and will to do his job as outlined in the TC
manifesto, and that finds a proper Testing Team as outlined in that same
manifesto, which we all voted on and agreed as part of our constitution.
Maybe one more:
Don't bitch at the most active developer when he used to have his own
branch that "it's not fair his ReactOS hare more features!!!" and then
hold a vote that bans "Misc branches", then complain about why he
doesn't use branches. It seems Art is the only one that remembers this :)
Alex: I agree but I certainly don't hold it against waxdragon. He's been
working hard and doing a good job with what he had. I think you're being
as unfair to him as casper ever was to you.
I've been pretty guilty myself, but reactos hasn't been an easy project to
work on recently; between recrimination and brokenness I've felt pretty
alienated from working on trunk. We need to increase hacker friendliness
here otherwise we're really sunk. If nobody can even run reactos just to
turn on debug messages, then I think we'll have trouble getting new devs.
Most of the devs we've had until recently joined when the GUI got going and
reactos had some successes running some apps.
We need a stable branch, or we need to branch dangerous edits. There's
no other choice imo. We can live with broken branches. We can't live
with a 100% nonworking operating system in trunk.
As to who's fault it is, it should not be up to one person or one group
to solve it whenever things are broken. Putting it all on Wax really is
a despicable thing to do. We each need to take responsibility for our
stuff when it's keeping ReactOS from booting or installing and allowing
others to work. There's an important distinction between saying
"something in our
process is broken" versus "our process is broken because of...". I
thought I clearly said the former.
http://www.reactos.org/wiki/index.php/ReactOS_Testing_Coordinator
Where is the testing team? Where are the weekly status reports? Where is
the webpage with the current "active list of applications, tools, and
testing environments used to test the builds. The TC should set up a
page or alternative method of visual real-time communication showing the
current applications tested/in testing and wether any flaws have been
noted. Preferably, specific features of each application should be tested."
The honest truth is that I've seldom worked at any company, no matter what
the resources that had testers this good, even with a QA army. Waxdragon
has been as good as anybody I've worked with in a paid position. Perhaps
the person who was so hopped up on getting all these votes to take place
should look in the mirror.
I'm sorry, but these things were NOT done and the
current TC breached
our voted rules and obligations. When I tried to tell him about it, he
told me "Well, I'll just quit then". Is this the responsible person you
want to have running a testing team? Maybe we should all resort to
blackmail and abandonning when someone criticizes our work.
I don't blame him. It is a responsible choice to leave a job you don't
feel right doing anymore.
I think it's despicable that you tried to tell me
what an "evil" person
I am for bringing this up. In real life, you don't get cookies for trying.
I didn't say you were evil, but you were blaming "the TC" for our failure.
QA is there to tell you about obscure bugs, not obvious ones. If your
software already fails before QA gets it, it has no business getting there
in the first place and you're just wasting their time. I don't blame our
TC for feeling this way.
If you want to get into how to run this like a successful software project
then we haven't even started yet.
--
Discordant is the murmur at such treading down of lovely things while
god's most lordly gift to man is decency of mind. Call that man only
blest who has in sweet tranquility brought his life to close.
If only I could act as such, my hope is good.
-- Aeschylus' Agamemnon (translated by H. W. Smyth)