Re: [ros-dev] Alternate shell?

[Martin Fuchs]

Hello,

would it be possible to get a dump or a copy of the ReactOS SVN
repository, so I can move the code and history of Explorer and
IBrowser (may be also Winefile) into my own repository - as you seem
to want removing it?

May be the simplest way would be to give me temporary shell access to
svn.reactos.org, so I can dump and filter it myself.

Regards,

Martin

2008/5/23 Steven Edwards [e-mail]:
> On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 8:59 PM, Dan Kegel [e-mail] wrote:
> > The menus are messed up (they contain garbage text), and
> > as I said earlier, there's no start menu.
>
> You should look at explorer-new. Its in the ReactOS source tree and
> being developed by Thomas Weidenmuller as a real Windows compatible
> shell replacement. Unfortunately it does not work on Windows or
> ReactOS at this time. The old ReactOS explorer will be removed when
> explorer-new is ready.
>
> --
> Steven Edwards
>
> "There is one thing stronger than all the armies in the world, and
> that is an idea whose time has come." - Victor Hugo
-- 
Martin Fuchs
[e-mail]

[Aleksey Bragin]

Hi,
it's quite far to the moment when explorer-new may substitute your  
current explorer, especially having in mind the development speed of  
explorer-new.

The subversion repository is open for cloning by everyone, in order  
to do this you just need to use svnsync utility (ships by default  
with newest versions), which is going to create you a 1:1 copy.

But, since it's not going to be removed anyway now (and in fact, it  
may still be in our repo, just moved to branch, or wherever where , I  
would suggest you do development still in the main svn.

Bytheway, do you have any plans about working more on it?

WBR,
Aleksey Bragin.

On Jun 8, 2008, at 12:11 AM, Martin Fuchs wrote:
> Hello,
>
> would it be possible to get a dump or a copy of the ReactOS SVN
> repository, so I can move the code and history of Explorer and
> IBrowser (may be also Winefile) into my own repository - as you seem
> to want removing it?
>
> May be the simplest way would be to give me temporary shell access to
> svn.reactos.org, so I can dump and filter it myself.
>
> Regards,
> Martin
>
>
> 2008/5/23 Steven Edwards [e-mail]:
> > On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 8:59 PM, Dan Kegel [e-mail] wrote:
> > > The menus are messed up (they contain garbage text), and
> > > as I said earlier, there's no start menu.
> >
> > You should look at explorer-new. Its in the ReactOS source tree and
> > being developed by Thomas Weidenmuller as a real Windows compatible
> > shell replacement. Unfortunately it does not work on Windows or
> > ReactOS at this time. The old ReactOS explorer will be removed when
> > explorer-new is ready.

[Martin Fuchs]

Hello,

thanks for the hint to use svnsync, I will give it a try. What is
currently exactly missing from explorer-new? I did not boot an up to
date ROS for a long time now. The problem with the source in the ROS
repository is, it get's a bit inaccessible over time. For example,
some time ago the VC project files have been deleted from the Wine
directory. So it's no more compilable as a single subproject - only as
part of the big build system. IBrowser is even not visible in a
branch, merely if you look into some old revision, as it was deleted
completely. I expect similar problems to happen also with ROS explorer
at some time in the future. You know I would still prefer an explorer
written in C++, but it seems most of you don't think this is the way
to go.
Currently I don't have any concrete plans to work on Explorer. It
became quite difficult to find and fix all those little bugs after the
base got stable - in conjunction with the GCC/MinGW restrictions.

Regards,

Martin
-- 
Martin Fuchs
[e-mail]


2008/6/7 Aleksey Bragin [e-mail]:
> Hi,
> it's quite far to the moment when explorer-new may substitute your
> current explorer, especially having in mind the development speed of
> explorer-new.
>
> The subversion repository is open for cloning by everyone, in order
> to do this you just need to use svnsync utility (ships by default
> with newest versions), which is going to create you a 1:1 copy.
>
> But, since it's not going to be removed anyway now (and in fact, it
> may still be in our repo, just moved to branch, or wherever where , I
> would suggest you do development still in the main svn.
>
> Bytheway, do you have any plans about working more on it?
>
>
> WBR,
> Aleksey Bragin.

[Colin Finck]

Martin Fuchs wrote:
> What is currently exactly missing from explorer-new?

As far as I see, only the main taskbar and desktop stuff is implemented.
The full file management and many additional dialogs are still missing.
> For example, some time ago the VC project files have been deleted from the

Wine
> directory. So it's no more compilable as a single subproject - only as
> part of the big build system.

You can still do "make msvc?" (where ? is the version number of your MSVC
version) and rbuild will create Visual C++ Project files for all modules.
Unfortunately, they rarely work without modifications, usually you have to
switch to the configuration with MS PSDK headers and add some additional
libraries or defines.

This was also the reason why most VC project files were deleted from the
tree.
> You know I would still prefer an explorer written in C++, but it
> seems most of you don't think this is the way to go.

The real problem is not the language, but the way the current Explorer is
implemented.
If we want to be compatible to Windows, we have to do things the same way
Windows does them: Windows' explorer.exe is just a simple binary, which does
most stuff through other DLL's like browseui.dll, shell32.dll, etc.
Our current Explorer implements most stuff on its own in one single EXE
file.
> It became quite difficult to find and fix all those little bugs after the
> base got stable - in conjunction with the GCC/MinGW restrictions.

GCC/MinGW restrictions?
The only restriction I can think of in this way is that all code must be
compatible with our main GCC/MinGW build system, but we highly appreciate
code, which is also compatible with MSVC (and in fact this is one of the
ultimate goals).

The main problem with MSVC compatibility currently is our rbuild build
system. In its current state, its very tightened to GCC/MinGW and quite
messed up even in conjunction with these compilers.
KJK started an attempt to work against all this mess, see
http://www.reactos.org/wiki/index.php/Rbuild_sucks for more information.

Best regards,

Colin

[Timo Kreuzer]

Colin Finck schrieb:
> Martin Fuchs wrote:
> > What is currently exactly missing from explorer-new?
>
> As far as I see, only the main taskbar and desktop stuff is implemented.
> The full file management and many additional dialogs are still missing.

I'd still vote for seperated shell and file manager.

[Colin Finck]

Timo Kreuzer wrote:
> I'd still vote for seperated shell and file manager.

What are your reasons?
And how do you want to accomplish that while retaining Windows
compatibility?
Many applications and also ReactOS already depend on "explorer.exe" being
the shell and the file manager.

In fact, most code of the "file manager" in Windows is implemented in
"browseui.dll" and not directly in "explorer.exe".
In Explorer, it's just one query whether a desktop window already exists,
then Explorer plays the shell, otherwise it plays the file manager.

Best regards,

Colin

[Maarten Bosma]

It's annoying that when the file manger crashes or hangs the hole
shell needs to be restarted.

Maarten

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Colin Finck [e-mail] wrote:
> Timo Kreuzer wrote:
> > I'd still vote for seperated shell and file manager.
>
> What are your reasons?
> And how do you want to accomplish that while retaining Windows
> compatibility?
> Many applications and also ReactOS already depend on "explorer.exe" being
> the shell and the file manager.
>
> In fact, most code of the "file manager" in Windows is implemented in
> "browseui.dll" and not directly in "explorer.exe".
> In Explorer, it's just one query whether a desktop window already exists,
> then Explorer plays the shell, otherwise it plays the file manager.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Colin
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[gedmurphy]

There's an option to open everything in separate processes.
It's in tools -> folder options -> view IIRC

-----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
Behalf Of Maarten Bosma
Sent: 09 June 2008 21:48
To: ReactOS Development List
Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Alternate shell?

It's annoying that when the file manger crashes or hangs the hole
shell needs to be restarted.

Maarten

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Colin Finck [e-mail] wrote:
> Timo Kreuzer wrote:
> > I'd still vote for seperated shell and file manager.
>
> What are your reasons?
> And how do you want to accomplish that while retaining Windows
> compatibility?
> Many applications and also ReactOS already depend on "explorer.exe" being
> the shell and the file manager.
>
> In fact, most code of the "file manager" in Windows is implemented in
> "browseui.dll" and not directly in "explorer.exe".
> In Explorer, it's just one query whether a desktop window already exists,
> then Explorer plays the shell, otherwise it plays the file manager.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Colin
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

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[João Jerónimo]

Colin Finck wrote:
> Timo Kreuzer wrote:
> > I'd still vote for seperated shell and file manager.
>
> What are your reasons?
> And how do you want to accomplish that while retaining Windows
> compatibility?
> Many applications and also ReactOS already depend on "explorer.exe" being
> the shell and the file manager.

I don't know whether this has anything to do with the file manager being
incorporated with the desktop shell, but (in windows) I can't open the file
manager as another user (other than the one that is executing the shell).

If this really has anything to do with the file manager being incorporated
inside explorer, than I think they should be separated.

JJ
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