Monthly meeting - April 2012

[Aleksey Bragin]

Hello,
Let me invite you to the monthly status meeting taking place last 
Thursday of this month, 26th of April, 19:00 UTC.

The meeting will be at irc://fezile.reactos.org  (Port 6667, no SSL) in 
the channel #meeting. Note that the IRC service will only be started 
shortly before the meeting. Your participation passwords will be emailed 
to you shortly before the meeting starts.
If someone still is not getting passwords sent before a meeting - please 
email Colin or Pierre before the meeting started to get one.

In order to save time, let's choose who is going to be the minute taker 
on the upcoming meeting. Volunteers welcome.

An agenda for the meeting will be posted when the meeting starts. Please 
email me your suggestions before the meeting so that the resulting 
agenda could be compiled beforehand.

With the best regards,
Aleksey Bragin.

[Pierre Schweitzer]

Hi,

the credentials have been sent and the server is up and running. Please
try your credentials BEFORE the meeting starts. After, it is too late.
In case you have troubles connecting, or if you did not receive your
credentials whereas you should have, please contact me BEFORE the
meeting starts.

As a reminder, the meeting will take place on fezile.reactos.org, port
6667, no SSL, on chan #meeting. This meeting will be private. If you do
not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.

Regards,

Le mercredi 25 avril 2012 à 18:18 +0400, Aleksey Bragin a écrit :
> Hello,
> Let me invite you to the monthly status meeting taking place last 
> Thursday of this month, 26th of April, 19:00 UTC.
>
> The meeting will be at irc://fezile.reactos.org  (Port 6667, no SSL) in 
> the channel #meeting. Note that the IRC service will only be started 
> shortly before the meeting. Your participation passwords will be emailed 
> to you shortly before the meeting starts.
> If someone still is not getting passwords sent before a meeting - please 
> email Colin or Pierre before the meeting started to get one.
>
> In order to save time, let's choose who is going to be the minute taker 
> on the upcoming meeting. Volunteers welcome.
>
> An agenda for the meeting will be posted when the meeting starts. Please 
> email me your suggestions before the meeting so that the resulting 
> agenda could be compiled beforehand.
>
> With the best regards,
> Aleksey Bragin.
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- 
Pierre Schweitzer [e-mail]
Systems Administrator
ReactOS Foundation

[Emanuel Rietveld]

On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> Hi,
>
> This meeting will be private. If you do
> not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
>
> Regards,

Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on 
your project?

Kind Regards,

Emanuel

[Ged Murphy]

It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
public?

Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
and discuss behind the scenes information. 
Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?

Ged.

-----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012

On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> Hi,
>
> This meeting will be private. If you do
> not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
>
> Regards,

Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on 
your project?

Kind Regards,

Emanuel

_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
[e-mail]
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[Sven Barth]

Am 27.04.2012 12:38, schrieb Ged Murphy:
> It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> public?
>
> Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> and discuss behind the scenes information.
> Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?

Also the meetings are already private since some time (December? 
January? before?)

Regards,
Sven
> Ged.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
> Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
>
> On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> >
> > Regards,
>
> Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> your project?
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Emanuel
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[Andrew Faulds]

Internal affairs? What internal affairs? If this was about legal
issues and thinks that definitely cannot be open to the public, I'd be
okay with it. But this is an open-source project, no? Surely meetings
should be public?

On 27 April 2012 11:38, Ged Murphy [e-mail] wrote:
> It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> public?
>
> Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> and discuss behind the scenes information.
> Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
>
> Ged.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
> Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
>
> On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> >
> > Regards,
>
> Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> your project?
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Emanuel
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- 
Andrew Faulds (AJF)
http://ajf.me/

Erm... does Firefox hold their meetings publicly? What about
LibreOffice?

On Fri, Apr 27, 2012, at 11:44 AM, Andrew Faulds wrote:
> Internal affairs? What internal affairs? If this was about legal
> issues and thinks that definitely cannot be open to the public, I'd be
> okay with it. But this is an open-source project, no? Surely meetings
> should be public?
>
> On 27 April 2012 11:38, Ged Murphy [e-mail] wrote:
> > It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> > public?
> >
> > Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> > and discuss behind the scenes information.
> > Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
> >
> > Ged.
-- 
With best regards
Caemyr

[Andrew Faulds]

Yes, Firefox's planning meetings have Guest URLs where people can
watch without being able to speak, I just checked.

On 27 April 2012 11:46,  [e-mail] wrote:
> Erm... does Firefox hold their meetings publicly? What about
> LibreOffice?
>
> On Fri, Apr 27, 2012, at 11:44 AM, Andrew Faulds wrote:
> > Internal affairs? What internal affairs? If this was about legal
> > issues and thinks that definitely cannot be open to the public, I'd be
> > okay with it. But this is an open-source project, no? Surely meetings
> > should be public?
> >
> > On 27 April 2012 11:38, Ged Murphy [e-mail] wrote:
> > > It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> > > public?
> > >
> > > Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> > > and discuss behind the scenes information.
> > > Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
> > >
> > > Ged.
>
> --
> With best regards
> Caemyr
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
-- 
Andrew Faulds (AJF)
http://ajf.me/

[Sven Barth]

Am 27.04.2012 12:44, schrieb Andrew Faulds:
> Internal affairs? What internal affairs? If this was about legal
> issues and thinks that definitely cannot be open to the public, I'd be
> okay with it. But this is an open-source project, no? Surely meetings
> should be public?

This was already discussed when the idea of private meetings was 
introduced on this list. I don't think this needs to be discussed 
again... (here is a link to that discussion: 
http://www.reactos.org/pipermail/ros-dev/2011-July/014586.html )

Regards,
Sven
> On 27 April 2012 11:38, Ged [e-mail]  wrote:
> > It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> > public?
> >
> > Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> > and discuss behind the scenes information.
> > Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
> >
> > Ged.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
> > Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> > Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> > To: [e-mail]
> > Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
> >
> > On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> >
> > Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> > your project?
> >
> > Kind Regards,
> >
> > Emanuel
> >
> > Ros-dev mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
> >
> > Ros-dev mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[Aleksey Bragin]

Let's put it a little bit less offending to the general public.

Those meetings are of primary interest only for the actual team of 
people which works on ReactOS now (so-called members). We try to define 
a common work direction for the next month and see what was successful 
and what failed during the last month.
It's just meaningless to invite everyone there.

Nevertheless, we do our best, and provide meetings minutes to anyone, so 
there are no secrets.

And to conclude my diplomacy with something harsh ;)
If a project is open source and free, it doesn't mean that everyone 
magically acquires rights to demand something from such a project. Free 
open source project grants you other, maybe even more important rights 
though.

Best regards,
Aleksey.

On 27.04.2012 14:38, Ged Murphy wrote:
> It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> public?
>
> Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> and discuss behind the scenes information.
> Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
>
> Ged.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
> Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
>
> On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> >
> > Regards,
>
> Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> your project?
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Emanuel

[WaxDragon]

IIRC, we publish the minutes of these meetings. That should be good
enough.  I am a "member" and I don't even attend these meetings! :0)
On Apr 27, 2012 4:21 AM, "Aleksey Bragin" [e-mail] wrote:
> Let's put it a little bit less offending to the general public.
>
> Those meetings are of primary interest only for the actual team of people
> which works on ReactOS now (so-called members). We try to define a common
> work direction for the next month and see what was successful and what
> failed during the last month.
> It's just meaningless to invite everyone there.
>
> Nevertheless, we do our best, and provide meetings minutes to anyone, so
> there are no secrets.
>
> And to conclude my diplomacy with something harsh ;)
> If a project is open source and free, it doesn't mean that everyone
> magically acquires rights to demand something from such a project. Free
> open source project grants you other, maybe even more important rights
> though.
>
> Best regards,
> Aleksey.
>
> On 27.04.2012 14:38, Ged Murphy wrote:
> > It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> > public?
> >
> > Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> > and discuss behind the scenes information.
> > Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
> >
> > Ged.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [e-mail] [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@**[e-mail]]
> > On
> > Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> > Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> > To: [e-mail]
> > Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
> >
> > On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> >
> > your project?
> >
> > Kind Regards,
> >
> > Emanuel
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/**mailman/listinfo/ros-devhttp://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo]

+1 to Wax

The reason i dont attend meeting currently is because im at the swimming
pool when meeting starts, through

On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 1:37 PM, WaxDragon [e-mail] wrote:
> IIRC, we publish the minutes of these meetings. That should be good
> enough.  I am a "member" and I don't even attend these meetings! :0)
> On Apr 27, 2012 4:21 AM, "Aleksey Bragin" [e-mail] wrote:
> > Let's put it a little bit less offending to the general public.
> >
> > Those meetings are of primary interest only for the actual team of people
> > which works on ReactOS now (so-called members). We try to define a common
> > work direction for the next month and see what was successful and what
> > failed during the last month.
> > It's just meaningless to invite everyone there.
> >
> > Nevertheless, we do our best, and provide meetings minutes to anyone, so
> > there are no secrets.
> >
> > And to conclude my diplomacy with something harsh ;)
> > If a project is open source and free, it doesn't mean that everyone
> > magically acquires rights to demand something from such a project. Free
> > open source project grants you other, maybe even more important rights
> > though.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Aleksey.
> >
> > On 27.04.2012 14:38, Ged Murphy wrote:
> > > It's just you, unless you can name a company that has their meetings in
> > > public?
> > >
> > > Meetings are for the members of organizations set goals, deal with issues
> > > and discuss behind the scenes information.
> > > Why should non-members have the right to listen in on internal affairs?
> > >
> > > Ged.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [e-mail] [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@**[e-mail]]
> > > On
> > > Behalf Of Emanuel Rietveld
> > > Sent: 27 April 2012 11:24
> > > To: [e-mail]
> > > Subject: Re: [ros-dev] Monthly meeting - April 2012
> > >
> > > On 04/26/2012 07:38 PM, Pierre Schweitzer wrote:
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > This meeting will be private. If you do
> > > > not have access, you will not be able to attend the meeting.
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > >
> > > > Is it just me, or this a little like spraying contributor repellant on
> > >
> > > your project?
> > >
> > > Kind Regards,
> > >
> > > Emanuel
> >
> > ______________________________**_________________
> > Ros-dev mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > http://www.reactos.org/**mailman/listinfo/ros-devhttp://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
>
> Ros-dev mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

[Emanuel Rietveld]

On 04/27/2012 01:20 PM, Aleksey Bragin wrote:
> Let's put it a little bit less offending to the general public.
>
> Those meetings are of primary interest only for the actual team of
> people which works on ReactOS now (so-called members). We try to define
> a common work direction for the next month and see what was successful
> and what failed during the last month.
> It's just meaningless to invite everyone there.
>
> Nevertheless, we do our best, and provide meetings minutes to anyone, so
> there are no secrets.
>
> And to conclude my diplomacy with something harsh ;)
> If a project is open source and free, it doesn't mean that everyone
> magically acquires rights to demand something from such a project. Free
> open source project grants you other, maybe even more important rights
> though.
>
> Best regards,
> Aleksey.

I realize the tone I wrote might have been offensive and I'm sorry. 
Please don't take it the wrong way - I don't want to demand anything 
from this project.

My thinking was, ReactOS might benefit from having more contributors, 
and I think having private meetings is one of the things that really 
hurts the ability of new people to come join in.

To be an attractive project for new contributors takes a lot effort, but 
it pays off when you can get more manpower behind your vision.

[Aleksey Bragin]

On 27.04.2012 15:57, Emanuel Rietveld wrote:
> On 04/27/2012 01:20 PM, Aleksey Bragin wrote:
> > Let's put it a little bit less offending to the general public.
> >
> > Those meetings are of primary interest only for the actual team of
> > people which works on ReactOS now (so-called members). We try to define
> > a common work direction for the next month and see what was successful
> > and what failed during the last month.
> > It's just meaningless to invite everyone there.
> >
> > Nevertheless, we do our best, and provide meetings minutes to anyone, so
> > there are no secrets.
> >
> > And to conclude my diplomacy with something harsh ;)
> > If a project is open source and free, it doesn't mean that everyone
> > magically acquires rights to demand something from such a project. Free
> > open source project grants you other, maybe even more important rights
> > though.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Aleksey.
>
> I realize the tone I wrote might have been offensive and I'm sorry. 
> Please don't take it the wrong way - I don't want to demand anything 
> from this project.
>
> My thinking was, ReactOS might benefit from having more contributors, 
> and I think having private meetings is one of the things that really 
> hurts the ability of new people to come join in.
>
> To be an attractive project for new contributors takes a lot effort, 
> but it pays off when you can get more manpower behind your vision.

It's fine, nevermind, as long as there is a constructive discussion, 
it's good.

What I, and probably others, wanted to say is that those meetings are 
totally not a way to attract more contributors. They are strictly a way 
to work with existing contributors. New people are always welcome to our 
IRC channels, mailing lists, web portal with forums and wiki, there is 
no need for some event.

Best regards,
Aleksey.