28 Jul
2011
28 Jul
'11
9:15 p.m.
Hello all,
Today's planned meeting has been postponed to the 25th August (the time
of the next regular meeting) based on a voting of the participants
present at 19:39 UTC. These were:
* Giannis Adamopoulos
* Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
* Maciej Bialas
* Thomas Faber
* Colin Finck
* Ziliang Guo
* Cameron Gutman
* Rafal Harabien
* Timo Kreuzer
* Matthias Kupfer
* Igor Paliychuk
* Sylvain Petreolle
* Daniel Reimer
* Pierre Schweitzer
* Samuel Serapion
* Olaf Siejka
○ Result:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Question: Please vote for a date for postponing
this meeting.
[19:44] <VoteBot> Answers:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Abstention - 7 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 11th August (in 2 weeks) - 3 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 25th August (in 4 weeks, regular next meeting) -
6 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> Total number of votes: 16
○ Main reasons were that the following people were still not present
at the time of voting:
* Aleksey Bragin (supposed meeting leader and key person in the
Arwinss and Release preparation agenda points)
* Amine Khaldi (supposed backup meeting leader and key person in the
CMake agenda point)
* Ged Murphy (key person in the GSoC and Driver Signing agenda
points)
○ Unfortunately, nobody has been prepared for this kind of situation,
so a lot of time has been wasted and confusing decisions might have
been made.
○ Postponing the points also gives Aleksey time to prepare a new
Arwinss build and the Build Environment guys (Daniel, me, anybody
wants to join?) time to prepare a final CMake version of RosBE, which
might be a factor when deciding about doing the migration to CMake.
○ The IRC Server has been closed at 20:03 UTC.
To allow the participants to get an unbiased idea about today's meeting,
I will post the original IRC log by the server to ros-priv. Would
actually like to make it public on ros-dev as well, but will abstain
from doing so until Ged's confusion about the openness of our meetings
is cleared.
If people have already prepared texts for this meeting (status updates,
whatever else you wanted to say), please send them to my E-Mail address
within the next 3 days and I'll compose a summary out of them, which I
will send to ros-dev.
If you think that these texts don't just deserve a simple summary, keep
them for the next meeting or do whatever you want about them.
And finally a personal note: Please keep in mind that it was not an easy
decision for me to just close the IRC Server after I believed that main
discussions were over. If I had left it running, it would have
invalidated the voting (again) and participants would have treated the
meeting even more as a joke. By closing it, I obviously received
complaints from people who had prepared stuff for this meeting and
wanted to revive it.
In good hopes,
Colin
29 Jul
29 Jul
8:14 a.m.
It's sad to hear that the meeting didn't work out and I apologise if my not
attending played a part in that.
My reasons for not attending mainly 2 fold:
I'm not happy with the public nature in which the meetings are held. Internal meetings
are an internal matter and should be held 'offline'.
To this point, the main issue I wanted to discuss was sensitive and involved not just
reactos' internal operations, but that of other projects too.
Therefore, as I said in my previous email, the driver signing issue was no longer on the
agenda.
Secondly, the meetings seem to have turned into a bit of a joke, for want of a better
word.
It's basically #reactos-dev with a voting feature. It takes far too long and gets very
little done.
The only interesting part for me is the GSoC updates, but this is something that can (and
probably should) be shared on the ros-dev mailing list anyway.
If anyone is truly interested in the cool stuff our GSoC guys are working on, all they
need to do is ask, they're all in IRC pretty much 24/7 anyway.
I therefore deemed the meeting rather pointless, and I'm a little busy with my own
work to sit in IRC for 3-4 hours watching streams of text flow up the screen.
Ged.
-----Original Message-----
From: ros-dev-bounces(a)reactos.org [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] On Behalf Of Colin
Finck
Sent: 28 July 2011 22:16
To: ReactOS Development List
Subject: [ros-dev] July Meeting Minutes
Hello all,
Today's planned meeting has been postponed to the 25th August (the time of the next
regular meeting) based on a voting of the participants present at 19:39 UTC. These were:
* Giannis Adamopoulos
* Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
* Maciej Bialas
* Thomas Faber
* Colin Finck
* Ziliang Guo
* Cameron Gutman
* Rafal Harabien
* Timo Kreuzer
* Matthias Kupfer
* Igor Paliychuk
* Sylvain Petreolle
* Daniel Reimer
* Pierre Schweitzer
* Samuel Serapion
* Olaf Siejka
○ Result:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Question: Please vote for a date for postponing
this meeting.
[19:44] <VoteBot> Answers:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Abstention - 7 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 11th August (in 2 weeks) - 3 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 25th August (in 4 weeks, regular next meeting) -
6 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> Total number of votes: 16
○ Main reasons were that the following people were still not present
at the time of voting:
* Aleksey Bragin (supposed meeting leader and key person in the
Arwinss and Release preparation agenda points)
* Amine Khaldi (supposed backup meeting leader and key person in the
CMake agenda point)
* Ged Murphy (key person in the GSoC and Driver Signing agenda
points)
○ Unfortunately, nobody has been prepared for this kind of situation,
so a lot of time has been wasted and confusing decisions might have
been made.
○ Postponing the points also gives Aleksey time to prepare a new
Arwinss build and the Build Environment guys (Daniel, me, anybody
wants to join?) time to prepare a final CMake version of RosBE, which
might be a factor when deciding about doing the migration to CMake.
○ The IRC Server has been closed at 20:03 UTC.
To allow the participants to get an unbiased idea about today's meeting, I will post
the original IRC log by the server to ros-priv. Would actually like to make it public on
ros-dev as well, but will abstain from doing so until Ged's confusion about the
openness of our meetings is cleared.
If people have already prepared texts for this meeting (status updates, whatever else you
wanted to say), please send them to my E-Mail address within the next 3 days and I'll
compose a summary out of them, which I will send to ros-dev.
If you think that these texts don't just deserve a simple summary, keep them for the
next meeting or do whatever you want about them.
And finally a personal note: Please keep in mind that it was not an easy decision for me
to just close the IRC Server after I believed that main discussions were over. If I had
left it running, it would have invalidated the voting (again) and participants would have
treated the meeting even more as a joke. By closing it, I obviously received complaints
from people who had prepared stuff for this meeting and wanted to revive it.
In good hopes,
Colin
_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
Ros-dev(a)reactos.org
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
10 a.m.
The presence should be counted at the start of the meeting, with up to 10 minutes for
delays. After that, the quorum should be counted by the number of participants who have
shown up at the meeting.
Repeating the vote once or twice just because bunch of people had joined like 40-50
minutes late is simply unacceptable.
On Fri, 29 Jul 2011 09:14 +0100, "Ged Murphy"
<gedmurphy.maillists(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's sad to hear that the meeting didn't work
out and I apologise if my
not attending played a part in that.
My reasons for not attending mainly 2 fold:
I'm not happy with the public nature in which the meetings are held.
Internal meetings are an internal matter and should be held 'offline'.
To this point, the main issue I wanted to discuss was sensitive and
involved not just reactos' internal operations, but that of other
projects too.
Therefore, as I said in my previous email, the driver signing issue was
no longer on the agenda.
Secondly, the meetings seem to have turned into a bit of a joke, for want
of a better word.
It's basically #reactos-dev with a voting feature. It takes far too long
and gets very little done.
The only interesting part for me is the GSoC updates, but this is
something that can (and probably should) be shared on the ros-dev mailing
list anyway.
If anyone is truly interested in the cool stuff our GSoC guys are working
on, all they need to do is ask, they're all in IRC pretty much 24/7
anyway.
I therefore deemed the meeting rather pointless, and I'm a little busy
with my own work to sit in IRC for 3-4 hours watching streams of text
flow up the screen.
Ged.
-----Original Message-----
From: ros-dev-bounces(a)reactos.org [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] On
Behalf Of Colin Finck
Sent: 28 July 2011 22:16
To: ReactOS Development List
Subject: [ros-dev] July Meeting Minutes
Hello all,
Today's planned meeting has been postponed to the 25th August (the time
of the next regular meeting) based on a voting of the participants
present at 19:39 UTC. These were:
* Giannis Adamopoulos
* Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
* Maciej Bialas
* Thomas Faber
* Colin Finck
* Ziliang Guo
* Cameron Gutman
* Rafal Harabien
* Timo Kreuzer
* Matthias Kupfer
* Igor Paliychuk
* Sylvain Petreolle
* Daniel Reimer
* Pierre Schweitzer
* Samuel Serapion
* Olaf Siejka
○ Result:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Question: Please vote for a date for postponing
this meeting.
[19:44] <VoteBot> Answers:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Abstention - 7 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 11th August (in 2 weeks) - 3 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 25th August (in 4 weeks, regular next meeting) -
6 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> Total number of votes: 16
○ Main reasons were that the following people were still not present
at the time of voting:
* Aleksey Bragin (supposed meeting leader and key person in the
Arwinss and Release preparation agenda points)
* Amine Khaldi (supposed backup meeting leader and key person in the
CMake agenda point)
* Ged Murphy (key person in the GSoC and Driver Signing agenda
points)
○ Unfortunately, nobody has been prepared for this kind of situation,
so a lot of time has been wasted and confusing decisions might have
been made.
○ Postponing the points also gives Aleksey time to prepare a new
Arwinss build and the Build Environment guys (Daniel, me, anybody
wants to join?) time to prepare a final CMake version of RosBE, which
might be a factor when deciding about doing the migration to CMake.
○ The IRC Server has been closed at 20:03 UTC.
To allow the participants to get an unbiased idea about today's meeting,
I will post the original IRC log by the server to ros-priv. Would
actually like to make it public on ros-dev as well, but will abstain from
doing so until Ged's confusion about the openness of our meetings is
cleared.
If people have already prepared texts for this meeting (status updates,
whatever else you wanted to say), please send them to my E-Mail address
within the next 3 days and I'll compose a summary out of them, which I
will send to ros-dev.
If you think that these texts don't just deserve a simple summary, keep
them for the next meeting or do whatever you want about them.
And finally a personal note: Please keep in mind that it was not an easy
decision for me to just close the IRC Server after I believed that main
discussions were over. If I had left it running, it would have
invalidated the voting (again) and participants would have treated the
meeting even more as a joke. By closing it, I obviously received
complaints from people who had prepared stuff for this meeting and wanted
to revive it.
In good hopes,
Colin
_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
Ros-dev(a)reactos.org
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
Ros-dev(a)reactos.org
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
With best regards
Caemyr
7:06 p.m.
If you want private meetings, use teleconferencing. That's not that hard of
a concept, is it? And there definitely needs to be a record of any
"internal" matters. Whether those records are immediately public or not is
up to the leaders of the ReactOS Project. However, I strongly advise against
keeping records permanently sealed private. It's a bad idea for a project
that relies largely on goodwill to survive.
I'm honestly surprised that this is an issue for you all. Even in my own
projects, I log everything, including private conversations. I don't plan on
releasing those logs anytime soon, but if I'm requested to do so, I'll
sanitize any sensitive information out.
And there's no such thing as truly internal matters in a public open source
project, unless they have something to do with the legal side of things. If
it has to do with legal issues, then by all means, use some sort of private
conferencing system. Legal issues are delicate enough as it is without
everyone else chipping in. Of course, I assume that the ReactOS Project
hasn't gotten itself into legal trouble since it moved the Foundation to
Russia...
On Fri, Jul 29, 2011 at 3:14 AM, Ged Murphy
<gedmurphy.maillists(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
It's sad to hear that the meeting didn't work
out and I apologise if my not
attending played a part in that.
My reasons for not attending mainly 2 fold:
I'm not happy with the public nature in which the meetings are held.
Internal meetings are an internal matter and should be held 'offline'.
To this point, the main issue I wanted to discuss was sensitive and
involved not just reactos' internal operations, but that of other projects
too.
Therefore, as I said in my previous email, the driver signing issue was no
longer on the agenda.
Secondly, the meetings seem to have turned into a bit of a joke, for want
of a better word.
It's basically #reactos-dev with a voting feature. It takes far too long
and gets very little done.
The only interesting part for me is the GSoC updates, but this is something
that can (and probably should) be shared on the ros-dev mailing list anyway.
If anyone is truly interested in the cool stuff our GSoC guys are working
on, all they need to do is ask, they're all in IRC pretty much 24/7 anyway.
I therefore deemed the meeting rather pointless, and I'm a little busy with
my own work to sit in IRC for 3-4 hours watching streams of text flow up the
screen.
Ged.
-----Original Message-----
From: ros-dev-bounces(a)reactos.org [mailto:ros-dev-bounces@reactos.org] On
Behalf Of Colin Finck
Sent: 28 July 2011 22:16
To: ReactOS Development List
Subject: [ros-dev] July Meeting Minutes
Hello all,
Today's planned meeting has been postponed to the 25th August (the time of
the next regular meeting) based on a voting of the participants present at
19:39 UTC. These were:
* Giannis Adamopoulos
* Javier Agustìn Fernàndez Arroyo
* Maciej Bialas
* Thomas Faber
* Colin Finck
* Ziliang Guo
* Cameron Gutman
* Rafal Harabien
* Timo Kreuzer
* Matthias Kupfer
* Igor Paliychuk
* Sylvain Petreolle
* Daniel Reimer
* Pierre Schweitzer
* Samuel Serapion
* Olaf Siejka
○ Result:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Question: Please vote for a date for postponing
this meeting.
[19:44] <VoteBot> Answers:
[19:44] <VoteBot> Abstention - 7 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 11th August (in 2 weeks) - 3 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> 25th August (in 4 weeks, regular next meeting) -
6 votes
[19:44] <VoteBot> Total number of votes: 16
○ Main reasons were that the following people were still not present
at the time of voting:
* Aleksey Bragin (supposed meeting leader and key person in the
Arwinss and Release preparation agenda points)
* Amine Khaldi (supposed backup meeting leader and key person in the
CMake agenda point)
* Ged Murphy (key person in the GSoC and Driver Signing agenda
points)
○ Unfortunately, nobody has been prepared for this kind of situation,
so a lot of time has been wasted and confusing decisions might have
been made.
○ Postponing the points also gives Aleksey time to prepare a new
Arwinss build and the Build Environment guys (Daniel, me, anybody
wants to join?) time to prepare a final CMake version of RosBE, which
might be a factor when deciding about doing the migration to CMake.
○ The IRC Server has been closed at 20:03 UTC.
To allow the participants to get an unbiased idea about today's meeting, I
will post the original IRC log by the server to ros-priv. Would actually
like to make it public on ros-dev as well, but will abstain from doing so
until Ged's confusion about the openness of our meetings is cleared.
If people have already prepared texts for this meeting (status updates,
whatever else you wanted to say), please send them to my E-Mail address
within the next 3 days and I'll compose a summary out of them, which I will
send to ros-dev.
If you think that these texts don't just deserve a simple summary, keep
them for the next meeting or do whatever you want about them.
And finally a personal note: Please keep in mind that it was not an easy
decision for me to just close the IRC Server after I believed that main
discussions were over. If I had left it running, it would have invalidated
the voting (again) and participants would have treated the meeting even more
as a joke. By closing it, I obviously received complaints from people who
had prepared stuff for this meeting and wanted to revive it.
In good hopes,
Colin
_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
Ros-dev(a)reactos.org
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
_______________________________________________
Ros-dev mailing list
Ros-dev(a)reactos.org
http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev
1 Aug
1 Aug
3:21 p.m.
On Jul 29, 2011, at 1:15 AM, Colin Finck wrote:
And finally a personal note: Please keep in mind that
it was not an
easy decision for me to just close the IRC Server after I believed
that main discussions were over.
It's sad to hear meeting didn't went good, and that the irc server
was so unexpectedly closed. Next time if I'm not able to participate,
I would call for shifting the meeting to another date.
WBR,
Aleksey.
4894
days inactive
4898
days old
4 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Aleksey Bragin -
caemyr＠myopera.com -
Colin Finck -
Conan Kudo (ニール・ゴンパ) -
Ged Murphy