Ros-dev July 2009

ros-dev@reactos.org

49 participants
52 discussions

by Colin Finck

Hello, We're planning to migrate the Web and Mail system to a new server and upgrade these components in the next 24 hours. This affects the whole Website at www.reactos.org plus all @reactos.org mail addresses including the mailing lists. During the migration, these services may be temporarily unavailable. The Web server migration includes upgrading the server components (e.g. Apache, MySQL, PHP) and applications (e.g. RosCMS, phpBB) to newer versions. Besides, the configuration of the server components was tuned for a better overall performance. The mail boxes, mail relays and mailing lists will be moved to a dedicated virtual machine, which will also offer a groupware system for official ReactOS developers and testers. Our plan is to do this upgrade in two big steps, namely first the Website and afterwards the mail stuff, to keep the downtime as low as possible. Minor problems are expected after the migration and will be fixed shortly. In case of major unforeseen problems, the downtime of particular components might be extended to the next 48 hours. Best regards, Colin Finck

16 years, 1 month

Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [dchapyshev] 42005: - Re-implement FreeLibrary (for support LOAD_LIBRARY_AS_DATAFILE) - HeapAlloc -> RtlAllocateHeap, GetProcessHeap -> RtlGetProcessHeap, HeapFree -> RtlFreeHeap, CloseHandle -> NtClose - Remove FIXME in LoadModule

by Aleksey Bragin

I think that part you removed was right, because that is ntdll's job. Wine, for historic reasons, have this code in kernel32, which is wrong. Same applies to the LoadLibrary call. WBR, Aleksey Bragin. On Jul 17, 2009, at 9:15 PM, dchapyshev(a)svn.reactos.org wrote: > Author: dchapyshev > Date: Fri Jul 17 19:15:17 2009 > New Revision: 42005 > > URL: http://svn.reactos.org/svn/reactos?rev=42005&view=rev > Log: > - Re-implement FreeLibrary (for support LOAD_LIBRARY_AS_DATAFILE) > - HeapAlloc -> RtlAllocateHeap, GetProcessHeap -> > RtlGetProcessHeap, HeapFree -> RtlFreeHeap, CloseHandle -> NtClose > - Remove FIXME in LoadModule > > Modified: > trunk/reactos/dll/win32/kernel32/misc/ldr.c

16 years, 1 month

Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [fireball] 42000: - Create a branch for upcoming work. "<XXX> people will eat you alive anyway so it doesn't really matter"

by Steven Edwards

On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 8:49 AM, <fireball(a)svn.reactos.org> wrote: > Author: fireball > Date: Fri Jul 17 14:49:16 2009 > New Revision: 42000 > > URL: http://svn.reactos.org/svn/reactos?rev=42000&view=rev > Log: > - Create a branch for upcoming work. > > "<XXX> people will eat you alive anyway so it doesn't really matter" And your going to make children cry when people see what your doing... -- Steven Edwards "There is one thing stronger than all the armies in the world, and that is an idea whose time has come." - Victor Hugo

16 years, 1 month

To all gurus out there

by Johannes Anderwald

Hello, It seems to have been come a ReactOS tradition, that every 2 / 3 weeks somebody turns up on the mailing list and shows her / his _unbelievable_ exciting groundbreaking phenomenal concept which will bring us to beta and save our boring sad, depressed sucicidal lifes. I do honor your efforts, but I can only speak for myself: 1) I do coding ReactOS for fun 2) I do coding ReactOS because I enjoy the challenge Please keep your ideas for yourself unless you come up with a business plan! Thanks Johannes

16 years, 1 month

On the growth of the reactos project

by Samuel serapion

Hello everyone. I find myself today thinking, as I sometimes do, about the ReactOS problem. How come we are trying to clone the biggest and arguably the most popular desktop OS in the world and still have such a small community/user base? The obvious answer to this question is that ros doesn’t do what it promises. Indeed it does almost run a lot of windows applications... some of the time, but that’s not the whole picture. Let us examine the typical(in my experience) first time encounter of a random computer user with reactos. <fanboy> Look, this is a free open source windows clone called ReactOS. It has solitaire and runs firefox. Awesome, isn’t it? <noob> so does it run my windows drivers and Office and COD4 and… !? <fanboy> well…. Umm… not really. Let’s analyze what went wrong: *1) *ReactOS base distribution is fine and great, I totally like my reactos with just a cmd window and dwnl.exe; but it’s not enough, except perhaps for someone that’s *extremely* motivated to do *something*interesting with ros. ** The solution, host a reactos distribution. I think its been proven that the reactos community doesn’t want to host more 3rd party code in the repository unless it’s absolutely necessary. But that doesn’t matter. We don’t need to build firefox, mono, or anything from source. The Windows model of software distribution is binary. There doesn’t have to be an update manager, reactos is just a toy(more on that later) and it needs to look useful so that people buy into it. Maybe a nice list of packages and some checkboxes in second stage installed with a script… 2) Hardware support is very poor, on recent hardware it almost never works(wild guess 75% fail rate on modern hardware) Problems range from unsupported video cards/ros driver uses wrong/unsupported mode, wrong storage bus, random crashes from unsupported usb devices + pcmcia other similar alien buses and just random bullshit. Even if nothing manages to bring down reactos, it of course has the wrong nic card and since usb storage doesn’t exist there’s no chance to get a driver and see ros crash because of course we only support a couple of drivers. I know this can’t just be magically fixed, but we need people dedicated to do hardware testing/debugging and provide real bug reports with traces. (Suggestion: allow kdbg to take ownership of the screen/give it back, provide visual console. I don’t care if it’s not a windows feature.) 3) Who cares about all the above? Not noobs, the question they really ask is: “Does it run XYZ?” What is XYZ? Flagship applications. The ones everyone knows and uses, commercial and opensource. The following, I think, are universally recognized as very important. a) Firefox + Flash (this works most of the time… maybe god will kill that mouse move bug) b) A recent version of Microsoft Office. (2007 would be very nice) c) Latest OpenOffice( imagine a make distro command that would tell ros setup to install it automagically, wouldn’t that make testing easier… heck we could have a super build bot that wrote documents in office and compiled shit with gcc and took 3 days to run….) d) .NET Framework (atleast 2.0) (This means fixing its installer bug) e) Java runtime. (it installs and almost launches limewire!! Christ!!) f) Visual Studio 2008 (installer fails, but the c++ compiler works and the IDE almost works!!) g) Recent versions of Adobe Photoshop, Dreamweaver or Flash. Extra points: h) Msn Messenger (its expected by windows users) i) Internet Explorer (screenshots floated around at some point with IE6, I think.. or maybe it was a dream) j) Virtual Box (with its drivers!) ( I just love the vm inside vm screenshot) k) Nmap (only pcap driver is broken!) l) Silverlight (seems to install) m) Itunes (with ipod support) (please dont be pricks about this list, make a poll or something if you must, but someone has to arbitrarily set it) The sad truth is that most of these applications are known to work to a certain degree. However, good bug reports don’t even exist. I’m confident that with a bit of determined effort these apps can be made to work. Atleast we need to compile a list of whats missing in ros that is need to support these and other important applications with real bug reports, and focus the project... give defined tasks to noobs that stumble into the project but are not knowledgable enought to dive into our huge code base and decide what are the missing features/features that need work/bugs. But really, what is the point of this email… 0.4.0 will be a milestone release(nice round number), people really want these and other similar applications to work(perhaps they are the reasons people still use windows). It makes sense to try and support them and would provide a nice PR boost if 0.4.0 can honestly be said to support any or all of the above applications. ReactOS is a developer toy, a cute little model of windows that almost works. If we can at least make it work for applications that most users actually use we could maybe, oh I don’t know… spark some interest. Yes, it’s about users, which we still won’t condone being alpha and all. But users are the ones that get excited and twitter and facebook and blog about the little OS that could; Excitement that will get developers exited, that will provide testers (I’m praying for some sort of reactos error reporting service, atleast a minidump….. atleast in usermode… support event logs…. for Christ sakes our bug reports suck and they suck10x worse when they come from noobs!). Right now we are stuck in the vm, so atleast make that experience enjoyable. There’s no need to rant about explorer, I hope… We have to start thinking about 0.5 and making reactos “beta”, and I still haven’t seen plans on how that’s going to happen or what exactly that means. ReactOS development needs to speed up and get more organized….. that’s all I have to say about that…. probably not…

16 years, 1 month

Open-source and newcomers

by Alex

Hello all, Open-source and newcomers ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I've been here for 2 weeks already and I want to share some thoughts from the point of view of a newcomer. I want to make a claim as an axiom and see where it goes from there. If you don't agree with the axiom you should probably read something on ethology and group behavior. I beg you to be open-minded. -- So the axiom is: "A closed group of humans (and many other social animals) usually is emotionally and irrationally unfriendly to newcomers, due to the evolutionary baggage we all share." The group assumes a hostile position to a newcomer. Many members don't realize what is going on. It simply feels like: "I just hate this guy!" Members, of course, feel special and somewhat better, just because they are part of the group. They see newcomers as not-worthy to some extent, just because the newcomer is not in the group. They see the newcomer as an alien and – as a threat. Subconsciously. Don't bother to reply and tell me that I am not-worthy to be seen as a threat :) The general feeling is "Who the f#ck he thinks he is? He's not from our group, he is not one of us (he didn't do anything to our project yet). Blah-blah-blah... I just hate this guy!". This irrational hate is very tangible, believe me. It is very de-motivational. (And I probably shouldn't have reacted the way I did to some of it, but, hey, I am no Jesus Christ, and it's only now that I've sorted those things out for myself). But you can say: Hey, we are not hostile, because: - "I, personally, entered the group in the past and it was Ok." - "Look at that guy and that guy – we were soooo nice to them!" Let's see... When can a closed group readily accept a newcomer? When it doesn't perceive him as a threat. This means the newcomer must come in a very submissive pose and exhibit not a slightest sign of aggressive attitude. Actually, the more you cry for mercy, the more chances are that you will be easily accepted into the group. Broken leg or being a total looser may help, as compassion will start to overtake the initial hostility. The "pose" on the text-based Internet is mainly how one talks. This is an example of a submissive pose: "Oh, Great Lords, you are so cool and I am not worthy. I beg you to let me develop for ReactOS, I am not much, but I will dutifully learn from you, Wise Masters, I will catch every word you say and ignore any insults you will throw my way. I will not criticize you in any way. I will do all the shitty tasks silently and obediently for several years until I slowly climb your social ladder. I will not complain of being called stupid and not-worthy 'cause that's who I am..." And so it goes... An ass-kisser, to be short. And then the Wise Great Masters will generously allow this no-worthy worm into their Temple. This happens everywhere. Just take a closer look. -- But this constitutes a problem. The group acts as a filter that favors the wrong kind of people. Because a good developer, after all, is usually opinionated, criticizes what he thinks is wrong, doesn't like to be called stupid and be given insults and shitty tasks. He challenges existing routines and things the group got used to. He is a threat. -- Unfortunately, I do not have a solution. I just want to attract your attention to it. P.S. You may ask – didn't you think that this hostility is a consequence of you being a jerk? If being a jerk means not kissing asses of Great Masters – then yeah, I may be guilty of that. P.P.S. Before posting a reply, please take a look inside you and try to see if that reply is based on "I just hate this guy!" :) Thanks! -- Best regards, Alex mailto:care2debug@gmail.com

16 years, 1 month

Very nice.

by Alex

Hello ReactOS, I am not sure if this is an appropriate place to write, but someone with the name Physicus has banned me from the #reactos channel, because he doesn't know physics and is ignorant enough. Ok, you want to stay ignorant - it's your life choice. But what right does he have to ban me from _reactos_ channel? So now I can't develop for ROS, just because one guy is closed-minded about his view of physics?!! Is it how you treat people around here? No wonder you have such a small number of developers... Human stupidity and arrogance has certainly no limits... -- Best regards, Alex mailto:care2debug@gmail.com

16 years, 1 month

Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [jimtabor] 41994: - Fix fixed math, thanks Lentin.

by Timo Kreuzer

jimtabor(a)svn.reactos.org wrote: > Author: jimtabor > Date: Thu Jul 16 21:34:42 2009 > New Revision: 41994 > > URL: http://svn.reactos.org/svn/reactos?rev=41994&view=rev > Log: > - Fix fixed math, thanks Lentin. > > Modified: > trunk/reactos/subsystems/win32/win32k/ntuser/class.c > > Modified: trunk/reactos/subsystems/win32/win32k/ntuser/class.c > URL: http://svn.reactos.org/svn/reactos/trunk/reactos/subsystems/win32/win32k/nt… > ============================================================================== > --- trunk/reactos/subsystems/win32/win32k/ntuser/class.c [iso-8859-1] (original) > +++ trunk/reactos/subsystems/win32/win32k/ntuser/class.c [iso-8859-1] Thu Jul 16 21:34:42 2009 > @@ -61,7 +61,7 @@ > { > int i; > > - for ( i = 0; i < 10; i++) > + for ( i = 0; i < 11; i++) > { > if (FnidToiCls[i].FnId == FnId) > { > Isn't there a constant for this?

16 years, 1 month

Re: [ros-dev] Very nice.

by WaxDragon

#reactos is not ##physics, so you weren't on topic. If this email is an example of your behaviour, I probably would have banned you too. -WD On Jul 15, 2009 7:30 PM, "Alex" <care2debug(a)gmail.com> wrote: Hello ReactOS, I am not sure if this is an appropriate place to write, but someone with the name Physicus has banned me from the #reactos channel, because he doesn't know physics and is ignorant enough. Ok, you want to stay ignorant - it's your life choice. But what right does he have to ban me from _reactos_ channel? So now I can't develop for ROS, just because one guy is closed-minded about his view of physics?!! Is it how you treat people around here? No wonder you have such a small number of developers... Human stupidity and arrogance has certainly no limits... -- Best regards, Alex mailto:care2debug@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Ros-dev mailing list Ros-dev(a)reactos.org http://www.reactos.org/mailman/listinfo/ros-dev

16 years, 1 month

Re: [ros-dev] [ros-diffs] [janderwald] 41970: - Interrupt is only shareable if the type is latched

by Dmitry Gorbachev

> (Descriptor->Flags & CM_RESOURCE_INTERRUPT_LATCHED) Is this right? ReactOS' KeConnectInterrupt() does not support interrupts edge-triggered and shared.

16 years, 1 month

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Ros-dev July 2009